Author Topic: Psychological decolonization  (Read 4196 times)

90sRetroFan

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Re: Psychological decolonization
« Reply #15 on: November 12, 2020, 11:04:46 pm »
OLD CONTENT contd.

"Many Indian Americans from this category also promote negative stereotypes about "blacks" for not achieving the same level of success."

Yes, I recall we began a discussion about this in the past. The problem is that they fail to challenge the axiom that succeeding under capitalism is worth respect. So it is up to us to challenge this as often as possible by emphasizing how capitalism has ruined the world beyond recognition, as well as by emphasizing the ugly personality traits (e.g. greed, aggressiveness, insensitivity) that capitalism tends to select for success (exception: pop culture icons). Once people learn to see capitalism as a general societal negative, they should logically proceed to viewing most winners under capitalism (not counting pop culture icons who genuinely inspire society in a positive direction) with disgust, and conversely viewing losers under capitalism with relief - at least they did not contribute to making things even worse than they already are!

This is why, for example, we are anti-gentrification (an issue that deserves its own topic). Walking around a de-gentrified neighbourhood gives me an instant burst of relief, as I can think to myself: "Finally this neighbourhood has reverted to only simple essentials, and the inhabitants are satisfied with this!" On the other hand, as soon as the gentrifiers turn up and start opening all kinds of new businesses, it feels like mini-colonialism all over again, and I feel an urge to vandalize all the gentrified units.

(This True Left position must not, however, be confused with the communist (and hence False Left) position of hostility towards all people who grew up rich, and solidarity with all people who grew up poor, without regard for their personalities. We despise people who want to make themselves rich, even if they grew up poor and are poor at present, no less than we despise people who are already rich and want to stay rich, or worse, become even richer. Whereas we respect people who - without deliberately trying to - happen to own plenty of money but who prefer to live frugally, no less than we respect poor people content with living frugally.)

---

I am more worried by the attitude described in the following article:

theconversation.com/white-mens-privilege-in-emerging-economies-isnt-measured-it-should-be-75557

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On the same day I interviewed a white Dutch man living in Gurugram, just south of New Delhi, I spoke with a black Congolese migrant. Their contradictory experiences speak eloquently about the impact of skin colour on shaping migrants’ everyday experiences.

The Dutch gentleman, who is in his 30s, told me he increased his business team’s success rate in closing business deals just by showing up.

If you bring a Western guy … then they really feel important, so if I come in there I almost feel like a God. […] Honestly, every meeting where I have been, they give me business afterwards … I always see that the business is increasing when I’ve been there. Not that because I’m so good, [but] because I’m a Western guy.

The Congolese gentleman had been living in India for about a decade. He had recently lost his job and been evicted from his apartment. He suspected that in both cases his dark skin was to blame. Africans have a very hard time finding housing in South Delhi’s more middle-class colonies because people don’t like to rent to Africans. Africans also report being vulnerable to sudden evictions and being harassed for rent money even when it’s not due.

The Dutch man’s white privilege makes him more effective in the workplace. It also imbues him with special status in the gated residential community where he lives with his family. He rents rather than owning an apartment, but was invited to sit in on meetings with homeowners – a privilege not extended to Indian tenants.
...
In both South Africa and particularly in India, white men from the west benefit from positive stereotypes. People believe they are wealthy, are a boon to the economy and are “legal” migrants.

In India, one factor stands out far above the rest. Almost every single white man from a “developed” country whom I interviewed candidly explained the positive effect his white skin had on his migration experience. Many felt a mixture of discomfort and surprise at the power they’d gained by moving from a white-majority society to a white-minority society. At home they looked like everybody else. In a country like India, their whiteness set them apart.

It also gave them an exponential social and economic advantage. They report being ushered into nightclubs and concerts and, according to one 20-something American man living in Bangalore, receive a lot of positive attention on dating apps like Tinder.

Whiteness is a selling point for many employers. I interviewed a British man in his 60s who was the headmaster at an elite South Indian private school. During a speech to parents, he explained that he was happy to relocate to India because one of his great-grandparents was actually Indian. His employers were unhappy that he’d mentioned this Indian heritage. Part of the school’s cachet and competitive advantage derived from having a “genuine white guy” in charge.

The last paragraph says it all..... Thoughts? How can we destroy this sickness?

---

More of the same awareness:

www.youthkiawaaz.com/2019/01/indians-are-the-biggest-racist-people/

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We can still argue that there is no racism in India, but news of attacks on Nigerian students in Delhi and Bangalore prove otherwise. The attack on African nationals is probably due to a racial stereotype from 19th-century European colonisers that they practice cannibalism. It has been engraved in our minds as well, thanks to our country’s association with Europe.
...
The truth is that every foreigner who is not white is treated badly. People assume that they are only here for the drug trade and prostitution. Indians themselves want to live in other countries, but will look down at and stereotype everyone from the African continent, seeing them as “tribals” who came here for illegal trade. The bias is that a foreigner who is white is always right.
...
Indians even carry their racist bias abroad. They will sit with groups of other Indians who speak their language, looking at African-Americans, and say “Woh dekh, kya kala hai na woh (Look at him, he is so black)!”

I was scrolling through several comments containing abuses and racist slurs against Nina Davuluri for winning Miss America in 2014. I saw Indians saying “How can she win the contest? She is so black!”

Nigeria never colonized India. In fact, Nigeria was a fellow victim of the same colonizer. What we would expect to have (in a sane world) is rapport between Indians and Nigerians (and indeed, more broadly, all former victims of colonialism around the world) against our common oppressors. Instead we have the exact opposite: worshipping the oppressors and throwing fellow victims under the bus (in a perverse attempt to imitate the oppressors' biases).

---

Colonial era propaganda sought to exacerbate caste divisions, so that “whiteness” could be upheld (similar to how the Vedics did back in the day). However, less westernized Indians (although traditional) are less racist, and even vegetarian, certainly not the same as the original Vedics who were meat eaters and extreme racists (what could be the reason for this?) It seems the only ones interested in upholding casteism are pro British Empire ZCs, and Turanian WNs.

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"However, less westernized Indians (although traditional) are less racist, and even vegetarian"

So are they actively trying to decolonize India, perhaps including in the aspects covered here? If so, please introduce them to this forum; it would be nice to have some help with decolonization.

"It seems the only ones interested in upholding casteism are pro British Empire ZCs, and Turanian WNs."

You make it sound like this is only a few people (which I wish were true). I am not so optimistic, especially with movies exacerbating the problem:

mediadiversified.org/2019/01/13/blackface-and-anti-blackness-in-bollywood-an-endemic-problem/

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With its immense influential power, Bollywood and mass media in South Asia have maintained the idea that having fairer skin is better. This is entrenched in the minds of hundreds of millions who consume South Asian cinema on a daily basis. The notion of conforming to Eurocentric beauty standards has found a home in South Asian mass media, including Bollywood, where they are reinforced through various types of consumable media in a myriad of ways.

Pop culture influences the way we compare ourselves to others. Bollywood’s massive influence has created a society where self-hatred due to colourism in South Asia is common, and conversely, how a society views its own people is reflected in how its biggest entertainment industry reflects them. Bollywood’s continual ignorance of the various shades of beauty in favour of whiteness epitomises how South Asians promote anti-Blackness. Fairness and skin-whitening on camera is already harmful, supporting the stereotype that whiteness equates happiness. Bollywood also works in anti-Blackness through the narrow lens of caricatures and stereotypes. Its history is rife with racist views towards Black people.

Global superstar Priyanka Chopra has built a career off colourism. In the 2008 movie Fashion, she plays a small town girl and aspiring model who, after making it to Mumbai and Bollywood, gets attracted to debauchery and decadence. Her negative spiral hits a “rock bottom” when she wakes up one morning next to a Black man. This is imagined to be her character’s lowest point despite her drug abuse, alcoholism and previous nefarious acts. Fashion went on to win multiple awards. For Bollywood, as an aspiring model, the worst thing you can do is position yourself sexually next to a Black person. Your skin has to be fair, so does your partner, it seems. For Chopra’s character, sleeping with a Black man was deplorable.
...
ambaqqt Ishq, another 2009 film, has one of the main characters undergoing a random security search at the airport. Detained and led by a white security guard, his mood appears relaxed until a Black security officer walks into the room. He’s instantly filled with fear before being thrown around and undergoing a cavity search. This is supposed to be funny but epitomises the offensive minstrelsy still being portrayed.

The weeds of white supremacy are still entangled firmly in Bollywood. Blackface and racist caricatures still exist. Minstrelsy is very much a part of how many South Asian people view Black individuals. And when Punjabi icons like Diljit Dosanjh, whose Twitter followings alone are in the millions, help further this vile image, it’s detrimental to how society treats its very people. Dosanjh launched his career through the 2012 movie Jatt and Juliet. In it, he breaks up with a woman after imaging their future children in blackface when he finds out she is moving to Africa to be part of a charity program.
...
Actors like Nandita Das are attempting to change mindsets by championing organisations like Dark is Beautiful. But, as she told The Guardian, she’s had to deal with directors attempting to lighten up her skin: “They always say to me: ‘Don’t worry, we will lighten you, we’re really good at it,’ as a reassurance. It’s perpetuating a stereotype that only fair-skinned women can be educated and successful.”

Whiteness, in a world still recovering from the effects of colonialism, has created the myth amongst South Asians that it equals wealth, advancement and prosperity. A colonial hangover mixed in with a caste system which dates back thousands of years allows us to see Black people as lesser than, as pawns to exploit on our own way to success. It’s a conditioned belief inherent in us like knowing how much haldi to put in a daal. It’s a long road to unlearning conditioned anti-Blackness within our community’s cultural success, but unless we fix the way we view it, we will forever be at the mercy of white supremacy.

What we need is a heavy dose of movies and TV shows set in the colonial era that portray the colonialists as the villains.

---

"casteism is promoted by foreign colonialist forces, in contrast to its characterization by the False (orientalist) Left as a uniquely Indian phenomenon."

I agree. But is merely exposing it as colonialist-promoted enough to convince people to discard it? I worry that it is not, and believe that we need to work on other countermeasures at the same time.

---

"What we need is a heavy dose of movies and TV shows set in the colonial era that portray the colonialists as the villains."

There's already a fair bit of those in Bollywood:

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thugs_of_Hindostan
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Manikarnika:_The_Queen_of_Jhansi

---

Yes, but Indians seeing movies about the British Empire colonizing India is unlikely to make them feel solidarity with Nigerians (for example). what needs to happen is that Indians must see movies about the British Empire colonizing Nigeria (so that they root for the Nigerian anti-colonialist heroes), while Nigerians are the ones who need to see movies like those you linked to (so that they root for the Indian anti-colonialist heroes). This is how we build rapport.

Even better would be crossovers.

90sRetroFan

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Re: Psychological decolonization
« Reply #16 on: November 12, 2020, 11:26:25 pm »
https://www.businessinsider.com.au/psychology-biases-that-benefit-white-men-2015-2

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In a recent Australian study, researchers asked 29 confederates of a range of genders and ethnicities to board buses, attempt to pay for the ride with a fare card that was out of money, and then ask for a ride to a station over a mile away when it didn’t go through.

In a Times op-ed, Yale law professor Ian Ayres said that the study “uncovered substantial, statistically significant race discrimination.”

He continued:

    Bus drivers were twice as willing to let white testers ride free as black testers (72% versus 36% of the time). Bus drivers showed some relative favoritism toward testers who shared their own race, but even black drivers still favoured white testers over black testers (allowing free rides 83% versus 68% of the time).
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90sRetroFan

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Re: Psychological decolonization
« Reply #17 on: November 22, 2020, 11:03:01 pm »
https://www.yahoo.com/lifestyle/dear-latinx-celebrities-don-t-213227534.html

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There's a troubling pattern in Hollywood; the announcement of Black milestones in the industry is often followed by Latinx celebrities reducing those advances to a mere stepping stone. The spirit of the argument for Latinx representation then becomes "why them and not us?" instead of "yay for them, now time for us."
...
only division and blame is produced by directly linking Black progress to Latinx stagnation.

While artists from all marginalized communities undoubtedly deserve increased equity and opportunity, each accomplishment for respective demographics should not set off a rush for the presumed last slice of diversity pie. This reoccurring battle between POC stars for the representation spotlight plays into a white supremacist system that habitually pits communities of color against each other, and more often than not, exposes a deeply embedded presence of anti-Blackness.

Within the Latino community, a history of anti-Blackness dates back to the Spanish colonialization of Latino America where a caste system structured by race viewed Black people as bottom tier. Casta paintings, 18th century lineage guides that prejudicially depicted racial mixing, even warned that bearing children with a Black person would lead to subpar, ill-mannered children. Similar to how white supremacy is still alive and thriving, anti-Black sentiment is still present in the Latino community and is most discernible in the hesitation to wholly accept Afro-Latinos as Latinos, and thus, Afro-Latino wins as Latino wins.
...
Sidelined communities have been conditioned to treat diversity and representation as a revolving door in which one has to wait their turn to cross the barrier. Though this view was born out of the uphill battle to make change, it prevents people of color from infiltrating spaces together.
...
So instead of playing into the white supremacist's game of a revolving door, stepping over one another to reach the inner circle, activists of color need to instead address the biases in their own communities that prevent them from dismantling the door altogether.

This is what I have been saying.

90sRetroFan

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Re: Psychological decolonization
« Reply #18 on: January 25, 2021, 01:20:22 am »
As you read the following article, consider how Eurocentric the victims have to be to so easily fall for such a scam. I have encountered first-hand many similar (albeit smaller-scale) scams over the years, all designed to target Eurocentric victims. In each case, if the exact same scam were attempted by a "non-white" swindler, it would surely have failed. But because the swindler was "white", it succeeded, because psychologically colonized people automatically trust everything coming out of a "white" mouth.

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2019/may/18/bleach-miracle-cure-uganda-us-pastor-robert-baldwin-sam-little

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Revealed: group led by Robert Baldwin and part-funded by Sam Little claims toxic fluid will eradicate HIV/Aids and other diseases

An American pastor from New Jersey backed by a British former clairvoyant is running a network that gives up to 50,000 Ugandans a “miracle cure” made from industrial bleach, claiming drinking the toxic fluid eradicates cancer, HIV/Aids, malaria and most other diseases.
...
The Guardian has learned that poor Ugandans, including infants as young as 14 months old, are being given chlorine dioxide, a product that has no known health benefit and can be extremely dangerous.
...
Baldwin, who trained as a student nurse and is understood to have no other medical expertise, said he chose Uganda because it was a poor country with weak regulation.
...
Little has posted a video online of a trip he made on 11 March to a village hospital in Kyenjojo district, in western Uganda, where he conducted a trial that he said would prove malaria could be cured with chlorine dioxide within two hours. Though he has no medical training, the Briton is seen on the video instructing workers in a tiny local hospital to administer the bleach according to the formula: 18 drops for adults, 12 drops for children aged five to 12 and eight drops for children aged one to four.

The video shows nine people being given two doses of the fluid, including a baby aged about 14 months who screams in his mother’s arms as he imbibes it.
...
The Uganda ministry of health was alarmed to hear about the MMS trials, saying it had no information about chlorine dioxide being tested in Ugandan hospitals. Emmanuel Ainebyoona, a spokesman for the ministry, said a government investigation had been initiated.

90sRetroFan

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Re: Psychological decolonization
« Reply #19 on: February 13, 2021, 01:26:51 am »
Another example of what goes on inside the mind of a "non-white" rightist:

https://incels.co/threads/i-wish-i-was-a-white-man-in-a-european-country.277246/

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I wish I was a western white men, how can I stop thinking about it?

Spain and Portugal, smaller than Kashmir ruled over the entire American continent..! Which is atleast 10x bigger than india..!

It must be cool to know that you belong to a race which dominated the entire world..! Made everyone thier slave..!

I would be happy just by knowing the fact that I belong to a race which forced thier language on a continent 100x bigger than thier own nation ( latin America).

I hate being a curry slave race, I hate indian culture, consider yourself lucky if you aren't born in this shitty curry culture. Curries have no modesty or respect, they always fighting among each other, scamming each other, what a filthy useless race.

Also the western white women are probably the most beautiful women on earth. Desired by everyone.
...
Wow, i hate being a curry.

I love the western civilization. Thank you England for saving us indians from our terrible civilization. Churchill was right, he said that jokers will rule over india if we Britons left .

And from the replies:

Quote
Being white in a white country is not that great. Being white in an ethnic country (especially in Asia) = you're a god.

We are not here to convert people like this - they are our enemies. We are here to expose them and ridicule them so that others can see what we think of them and hence be aware that anti-Eurocentrists also exist, and how superior we are compared to the Eurocentrists.

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Stevie Wonder tells Oprah he's leaving US for Ghana -- permanently
Quote
"I don't want to see my children's children's children have to say, 'Oh, please like me, please, please respect me, please know that I'm important, please value me,'" he explained.

In 1994, the "Superstition" singer told a Washington gathering of the International Association of African American Music that he had grown fond of Ghana while visiting.

According to the Orlando Sentinel, he said he feels that "there's more of a sense of community there."
https://www.foxnews.com/entertainment/stevie-wonder-tells-oprah-leaving-the-us-ghana-permanently

If rightists take over the U.S. they will be in Ghana colonizing your asses all over again and sooner than you might be able to imagine. This time they'll show-up with the threat of nukes though....

It's sad to see people fall for the false sense of safety leaving the U.S. gives them. They do not understand the colonial era at all. Western civilization will never leave non-Westerners alone as long as it is still alive.

90sRetroFan

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"I don't want to see my children's children's children have to say, 'Oh, please like me, please, please respect me, please know that I'm important, please value me,'" he explained.

They don't have to. They just need to be willing to use firearms.

guest5

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Quote
"I don't want to see my children's children's children have to say, 'Oh, please like me, please, please respect me, please know that I'm important, please value me,'" he explained.

They don't have to. They just need to be willing to use firearms.

"Blacks" rarely shoot "whites", especially for their "white" racism, unfortunately. It seems like many "blacks" like waving firearms around on social media, music videos, etc. just like "whites" do, the only difference being that "whites" have no issue with shooting at "blacks", while "blacks" primarily shoot other "blacks". How do we change this? How do we overcome the "black" fear of "whites"?

90sRetroFan

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It really is ridiculous. In South Africa, "non-whites" are over 90% of the population, yet even here the most they seem willing to do is sing about it:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4NVkRmBTB7k

If singing worked, Hezbollah would be a choir. It is not. It is a paramilitary. Because singing doesn't work. Shooting works.

The South African government is too cowardly to even wipe out tiny Orania FFS:

https://trueleft.createaforum.com/enemies/orania/

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How do we change this? How do we overcome the "black" fear of "whites"?

Back in the old days, JAM promoted this book heavily:

https://www.amazon.com/Black-Commandos-Warriors-Forged-Blood/dp/061583843X

Download here:

https://val.serc.iisc.ernet.in/b7bjbh6owwe8/11-kaylah-zieme/061583843X-the-black-commandos-warriors-forged-from-blood-s-th.pdf

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Re: Racist bullying
« Reply #24 on: March 18, 2021, 08:52:10 pm »
New Teen Vogue EIC Alexi McCammond apologizes for past anti-Asian tweets
Quote
I've apologized for my past racist and homophobic tweets and will reiterate that there's no excuse for perpetuating those awful stereotypes in any way," Alexi McCammond wrote.
https://nypost.com/2021/03/10/new-teen-vogue-eic-alexi-mccammond-apologizes-for-controversial-tweets/?utm_campaign=SocialFlow&utm_source=NYPTwitter&utm_medium=SocialFlow


McCammond made those tweets in 2011. Now that she's being called out on them she apologizes. She is NOT sorry at all and anyone who gives her a pass is an accomplice.

Seems to me a lot of the people who are physically ugly in appearance are often also ugly personality wise....

Quote
@Lex_Jurgen
·
Mar 11
A tortured semantic that true POC must be disadvantaged. The strategy is to eliminate Asian Americans from benefits designated for "equity" programs under the guise they've never been systemically oppressed. Odd considering many are being beaten in the streets today for being AA.




90sRetroFan

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Re: Re: Racist bullying
« Reply #25 on: March 18, 2021, 10:23:42 pm »
Quote
I've apologized for my past racist and homophobic tweets

She still has all her fingers, so she has not apologized.

rp

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Re: Psychological Decolonization
« Reply #26 on: March 18, 2021, 10:26:27 pm »
Worth noting that she is part "non-White". Goes to show that even "non-Whites" will denigrate other "non-Whites" to be accepted by "whites". I have witnessed this firsthand, when a girl of Indian descent denigrated "arabs" in front of her "white" friends.
« Last Edit: June 01, 2021, 09:08:22 pm by rp »

90sRetroFan

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Re: Re: Racist bullying
« Reply #27 on: March 18, 2021, 10:47:02 pm »
""non-Whites" will denigrate other "non-Whites" to be accepted by "whites"."

This is why we need:

https://trueleft.createaforum.com/issues/psychological-decolonization/

"a girl of Indian descent denigrated "arabs" in front of her "white" friends."

I am glad you called her "of Indian descent" because she herself does not deserve to be called Indian:



https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India%E2%80%93Saudi_Arabia_relations

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Trade and cultural links between ancient India and Arabia date back to the third millennium BC.[2] By 1000 AD, the trade relations between southern India and Arabia flourished and became the backbone of the Arabian economy.[3]

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/India%E2%80%93United_Arab_Emirates_relations

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Since 3000 B.C, relations between India and the seven emirates which now make up the United Arab Emirates were traditionally close. The UAE and India had enjoyed close and friendly ties based on historic and cultural ties.

etc.

She is in fact a traitor to India:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglo-Mysore_Wars

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglo-Maratha_Wars

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Anglo-Sikh_wars

etc.

rp

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Re: Psychological Decolonization
« Reply #28 on: March 18, 2021, 10:52:47 pm »
I actually used "of Indian descent" because she was born in America, but your explanation works as well. Henceforth I will use the phrase to refer to Eurocentrists who are from India. In fact, I should have used "of Indian background" for the girl I was talking about.

"Since 3000 B.C, relations between India and the seven emirates which now make up the United Arab Emirates were traditionally close. The UAE and India had enjoyed close and friendly ties based on historic and cultural ties."

Recently I travelled to India through the UAE and saw just how much cultural similarities there are between "Arab" countries and India. Many Indians find Dubai very hospitable and welcoming.

But alas, even here there exists the problem of Eurocentrism. My uncle who used to live in Dubai would comment on how the native Emiratis would treat Indian expats like ****, but would kiss the ass of "White" Westerners, the most prominent example of this being the police force.

In this regard, Qatar is superior to the UAE because it is relatively less Westernized compared to the UAE, be it in terms of diplomatic ties (i.e. Israel) or social norms (e.g. the restriction of alcohol). I have not heard any complaints about Eurocentrism in Qatar.
« Last Edit: June 01, 2021, 09:06:59 pm by rp »

90sRetroFan

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Re: Re: Racist bullying
« Reply #29 on: March 19, 2021, 02:40:12 am »
"she was born in America"

Of course she does not deserve to be called American either.

"Recently I travelled to India through the UAE and saw just how much cultural similarities there are between "Arab" countries and India."

No "" needed around Arab. It is a real language, not a Western concept:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Arabic

"the native Emiratis would treat Indian expats like ****"

Despite being fellow victims of two Western colonial empires in a row.....





"but would kiss the ass of "White" Westerners"

Sigh.....