Author Topic: Savitri Devi and the BNP  (Read 494 times)

Flutter

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Savitri Devi and the BNP
« on: August 20, 2020, 04:30:25 pm »
Any ideas why Savitri Devi chose to associate with the blatantly racist (among other things) British National Party?

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Flutter

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Re: Savitri Devi and the BNP
« Reply #1 on: August 20, 2020, 06:20:01 pm »
http://cdn.counter-currents.com/radio/GantryTape1Part1.mp3


29 minutes in it's implied that she was a "lesbian", so I guess that's a win for the Gender Issues page (which would certainly **** off the homophobic John Tyndall!). 42 minutes in though, peroxiding her hair to be more "Aryan"? That's not in line with the main sites ideas at all, if true.

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Re: Savitri Devi and the BNP
« Reply #2 on: August 20, 2020, 07:38:05 pm »
Too bad the original NS didn't have access to all the information we now do. I always try and keep that thought in mind when viewing NS history. On that same note though, considering what information they had available to them it is quite amazing where they ended up ideologically, especially Hitler.

Lest we also forget that Savitri Devi spied on the allies for the axis powers....

Many also sought her knowledge and wisdom while she was still alive, from all walks of life.

FuckDugin

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Re: Savitri Devi and the BNP
« Reply #3 on: August 20, 2020, 08:17:18 pm »
When evaluating historic National Socialists, we also need to keep in mind that they were socialized in an entirely different climate than we are. Devi grew up in France, at that time one of the epicenters of Western civilization, still during the colonial age. The racism of the BNP likely didn't differ much from the level of racism she was already used to, so it could have easily slipped past her radar, leading her to assume they were on the same page simply based on her BNP-contacts' self-identification as National Socialists.

90sRetroFan

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Re: Savitri Devi and the BNP
« Reply #4 on: August 21, 2020, 12:41:56 am »
At that time in the UK, it would probably have appeared easier to try to persuade on other issues a party already hostile towards Jews than to try to create hostility towards Jews among other parties. BDS and the associated leftist hostility towards Jews did not exist back then (BDS was only founded in 2005). In conjunction, Savitri Devi already knew she did not have long to live (she died in 1982, the same year the BNP was founded(!)), hence could not expect to have many years to spend waiting for a better organization to come along, but had to take her last shot with with whatever was immediately available at the time. In light of this, her association with the BNP is understandable. My best guess is that she had hoped that the fledgling BNP would incorporate some of her ideas in order to distinguish itself from the NF (from which the BNP was splitting), thus at least creating a comparatively more ethical party to rival the NF.

With that said, Savitri's grasp of Aryan racial theory was very messy. She never provided a central definition of the term in her own writings, but made only peripheral judgements on who was or was not Aryan based on throwaway criteria (mostly while writing about other subjects!). While Savitri and I might agree on an individual historical figure's Aryan quality, we are more likely than not to differ in where we guess their blood came from. For example, Savitri credited Akhnaten's Aryan blood to alleged Hittite ancestry, whereas I credit it to Puntian ancestry.
« Last Edit: August 21, 2020, 12:44:03 am by 90sRetroFan »

Flutter

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Re: Savitri Devi and the BNP
« Reply #5 on: August 21, 2020, 03:39:29 am »
At that time in the UK, it would probably have appeared easier to try to persuade on other issues a party already hostile towards Jews than to try to create hostility towards Jews among other parties. BDS and the associated leftist hostility towards Jews did not exist back then (BDS was only founded in 2005). In conjunction, Savitri Devi already knew she did not have long to live (she died in 1982, the same year the BNP was founded(!)), hence could not expect to have many years to spend waiting for a better organization to come along, but had to take her last shot with with whatever was immediately available at the time. In light of this, her association with the BNP is understandable. My best guess is that she had hoped that the fledgling BNP would incorporate some of her ideas in order to distinguish itself from the NF (from which the BNP was splitting), thus at least creating a comparatively more ethical party to rival the NF.

Ah, I think we've both been confused here. The photographs with Tyndall and BNP camps are from the 1960s, long before here death. Reason being it is a different British National Party (I only just remembered there have been several such parties!).
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/British_National_Party_(disambiguation)

I am less familiar with this version of the BNP, but it still strikes me as thoroughly unhealthy company even for its time, with the same White "Nationalist" Tyndall of the later BNP.

christianbethel

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Re: Savitri Devi and the BNP
« Reply #6 on: September 05, 2020, 08:04:23 pm »
...Savitri's grasp of Aryan racial theory was very messy. She never provided a central definition of the term in her own writings, but made only peripheral judgements on who was or was not Aryan based on throwaway criteria (mostly while writing about other subjects!). While Savitri and I might agree on an individual historical figure's Aryan quality, we are more likely than not to differ in where we guess their blood came from. For example, Savitri credited Akhnaten's Aryan blood to alleged Hittite ancestry, whereas I credit it to Puntian ancestry.

I assume that is the explanation for this quote:
Quote
“The one thing I strongly object to in your paper is your calling Negroes ‘animals.’ I love animals—all, but especially felines. They— and they especially—are beautiful. Negroes are not. That is the first thing I have against them: their flattened noses, thick lips, tiny high-set ears, and woolly hair. I never for an hour believed in man descending from ‘the ape.’ I’d rather think it far more likely that apes (especially of the big size) are descended from man—and the Negro, so similar to them that it seems incredible at times, could well be the intermediate stage in the process of decay. That is why there are Negro tribes that cling onto bits of genuine tradition, without the slightest knowledge, of course, of what they are accepting—theoretically.”
National Socialism ≠ Nazism

Aryan ≠ 'White'.

Race = Quality && Race ≠ Ethnicity.

History is written by the victors.

The truth fears no investigation.

(He) who controls the past controls the future; (he) who controls the present controls the past.

UNITY THROUGH NOBILITY.

90sRetroFan

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Dazhbog

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Re: Savitri Devi and the BNP
« Reply #8 on: September 06, 2020, 09:35:54 am »
I think it is also noteworthy that the features listed by Savitri Devi are associated with the Congoid type, i.e. Gentile-leaning "Black" persons. Aryan-leaning "Black" phenotypes (see the Human Beauty-page for examples) do not fit her description at all. Thus it appears that she is applying the term "Negro" to Gentile-leaning "Black" persons exclusively, implying that Aryan-leaning "Black" persons wouldn't be included in her "Negro"-category and thus not affected by her dislike for "Negroes".

90sRetroFan

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Re: Savitri Devi and the BNP
« Reply #9 on: September 06, 2020, 03:41:57 pm »
"I think it is also noteworthy that the features listed by Savitri Devi are associated with the Congoid type, i.e. Gentile-leaning "Black" persons."

Quote
flattened noses, thick lips, tiny high-set ears, and woolly hair.

The burden is on you to explain how these four features would have been selected for by a hunting lifestyle, and selected against by a subsistence farming lifestyle.

"Aryan-leaning "Black" phenotypes"



Flattened nose, check.
Thick lips, check.
(Ears cannot be seen clearly.)
Woolly hair, check.
Aryan face, check.
« Last Edit: September 06, 2020, 03:54:58 pm by 90sRetroFan »

Dazhbog

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Re: Savitri Devi and the BNP
« Reply #10 on: September 06, 2020, 06:10:56 pm »
Nevermind. I stand corrected.

christianbethel

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Re: Savitri Devi and the BNP
« Reply #11 on: August 12, 2022, 12:37:03 pm »
National Socialism ≠ Nazism

Aryan ≠ 'White'.

Race = Quality && Race ≠ Ethnicity.

History is written by the victors.

The truth fears no investigation.

(He) who controls the past controls the future; (he) who controls the present controls the past.

UNITY THROUGH NOBILITY.