Author Topic: True Left breakthrough: degendering  (Read 1147 times)

Polinc_Socjus

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Re: True Left breakthrough: degendering
« Reply #15 on: January 20, 2022, 02:19:25 am »
"There could also be confusions using 'it', I would assume you were not talking about a person if you referred to an 'it'. Even if you disagree, using they/them is in agreement with more mainstream gender-neutral language and cannot be considered in any way insulting, whereas "it" can be."

There are some who prefer It/Its pronouns for themselves. Some would say that's dehumanizing, but I see that as an opportunity to criticize anthropocentrism. Theoretically if you think of gender as a compass instead of a single spectrum, It/Its could be seen as implicitly neither masculine nor feminine (neotenous), while They/Them could be seen as implicitly both masculine and feminine (androgynous).

I've been contemplating using It/Any pronouns on myself for these and other reasons. But I would still use They/Them for most situations for the reasons you mentioned.

This could also be explored in fiction.

bondburger

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Re: True Left breakthrough: degendering
« Reply #16 on: January 20, 2022, 03:19:06 am »
There are some who prefer It/Its pronouns for themselves. Some would say that's dehumanizing, but I see that as an opportunity to criticize anthropocentrism. Theoretically if you think of gender as a compass instead of a single spectrum, It/Its could be seen as implicitly neither masculine nor feminine (neotenous), while They/Them could be seen as implicitly both masculine and feminine (androgynous).

I don't see they/them as necessarily androgynous. I think that the association of they/them with androgyny may be an artifact of the assumption that people are gendered beings. It makes sense that they/them would carry such artifacts as it is used in reference to people, so it reflects the ways in which people are typically viewed.

Countering anthropocentrism is a good reason for it-pronouns, but I would prefer to fight anthropocentrism the other way by referring to more non-humans (starting with animals!) as they/them. This reinforces the idea that animals are beings like us and not objects (goys) to be exploited. Referring to all beings as "it" would not change anything about the way we talk about any non-humans, and so it does not have this advantage. This may also further normalise the objectification and exploitation of humans aswell as non-humans.
« Last Edit: January 20, 2022, 03:25:54 am by bondburger »
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90sRetroFan

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Re: True Left breakthrough: degendering
« Reply #17 on: April 19, 2022, 09:39:42 pm »
Good!

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/disney-removes-ladies-and-gentlemen-boys-and-girls-magic-kingdom-fireworks/

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The original introduction included, "Good evening, ladies and Gentlemen, boys and girls, dreamers of all ages." Now, the greeting is "Good evening, dreamers of all ages."

The rightist reaction:

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The change caused a mixed reaction on social media. Some Twitter users were outraged, with one writing "I HATE THAT. BRING IT BACK NOW!!!"

The leftist reaction:

Quote
Others say they welcome the new change. "I love "Dreamers of all ages" because it really makes that super snuggly and more magical. It's so heartwarming," one person tweeted.

90sRetroFan

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Re: True Left breakthrough: degendering
« Reply #18 on: June 18, 2022, 08:51:51 pm »
Even the most elementary degendering, such as everyone filling in the same form, upsets worshippers of sexual dimorphism:

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-10928505/Male-blood-donor-turned-away-clinic-refused-answer-pregnant.html

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Mr Sinclair, 66, was told to fill in a form which asked whether he was expecting a child or had been pregnant in the past six months.

When he complained that as a man in his 60s this question did not apply and he should not have to answer it, Mr Sinclair said staff at the clinic told him they could not accept his blood.
...

...
'It is nonsensical and it makes me angry because there are vulnerable people waiting for blood, including children, and in desperate need of help. But they've been denied my blood because of the obligation to answer a question that can't possibly be answered.'

If he is not pregnant, just tick the 'No' box! What is so difficult about that?

Sinclair also looks like what we would expect:


christianbethel

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Re: True Left breakthrough: degendering
« Reply #19 on: June 19, 2022, 05:06:56 pm »
Quote
Right (and False Left):

"In His own image created He them; male and female created He them." - Tanakh

True Left:

"When you make the male and the female one, so that the male will not be male nor the female female ... then will you enter the Kingdom.” - Jesus

Correction:
Right (and False Left):

"In His own image created He them; male and female created He them." - Genesis 1:27
True Left:

"When you make the male and the female one, so that the male will not be male nor the female female ... then will you enter the Kingdom.” - Thomas 22:5,7
When in doubt, use the 16 Words: 'We must Engineer the Destruction of Western Civilization and Tribalism, and Unite All Races Through Nobility.'

Aryan ≠ 'White'.

History is Written by the Victors.

He Who Controls the Past Controls the Future; He Who Controls the Present Controls the Past.

guest78

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Re: True Left breakthrough: degendering
« Reply #20 on: June 19, 2022, 05:34:16 pm »
The Gospel of Thomas are sayings attributed to Jesus, not Thomas.

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Gospel of Thomas. (Translated by Thomas O. Lambdin). These are the secret sayings which the living Jesus spoke and which Didymos Judas. Thomas wrote down.

christianbethel

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Re: True Left breakthrough: degendering
« Reply #21 on: June 19, 2022, 06:35:17 pm »
(Sigh) I know that, but it's important for those looking for sources for bible/Gnostic text study to cite the proper book, chapter, and verse. Besides, anyone who sees that quote is invariably going to ask, 'Where does He say that?', so I'm helping them out.
When in doubt, use the 16 Words: 'We must Engineer the Destruction of Western Civilization and Tribalism, and Unite All Races Through Nobility.'

Aryan ≠ 'White'.

History is Written by the Victors.

He Who Controls the Past Controls the Future; He Who Controls the Present Controls the Past.

90sRetroFan

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Re: True Left breakthrough: degendering
« Reply #22 on: June 24, 2022, 04:27:36 am »
Our enemies complain about common sense:

https://gatesofvienna.net/2022/06/how-dare-you-misgender-me/

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From next year, the booking system must also be changed so that Deutsche Bahn no longer only addresses its customers with “Mr.” or “Mrs.” [What about “It”?] Either it must be dropped completely, or the company must find a third form of address, which has so far been completely unclear.
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“There are still no universally recognized standards for addressing non-binary gender people in the German-speaking world,” said a spokeswoman for Die Welt. Even within the group of people affected, the ideas about this are currently still very different.

Why not simply "Guest" ("Gast") for everyone?
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90sRetroFan

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Re: True Left breakthrough: degendering
« Reply #23 on: August 06, 2022, 04:32:26 am »
Some history:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bKaVI-IStNE

Let's finish the job!

rp

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Re: True Left breakthrough: degendering
« Reply #24 on: November 17, 2022, 09:50:51 pm »
SNL makes fun of MTG's gender obsession:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=L4VGtQBXjY8

90sRetroFan

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Re: True Left breakthrough: degendering
« Reply #25 on: December 22, 2022, 04:47:58 pm »
https://americanmilitarynews.com/2022/12/marine-corps-may-drop-maam-and-sir-for-drill-instructors/

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The Marine Corps has been advised that its drill instructors should no longer be referred to by gendered terms like “ma’am” or “sir” — an idea that a top training leader has pushed back on.
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“The Army, Navy, and Coast Guard effectively de-emphasize gender in an integrated environment,” the report says. “Instead of saying ‘ma’am’ or ‘sir,’ recruits in these Services refer to their drill instructors using their ranks or roles followed by their last names. Gendered identifiers prime recruits to think about or visually search for a drill instructor’s gender first, before their rank or role.”

The report’s authors add, “By teaching recruits to use gender-neutral identifiers for their drill instructors, Services underscore the importance of respecting authoritative figures regardless of gender.”

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=mGAwNV7WBIQ

But we always knew Marines are the most toxic branch:

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Across all military branches, the Marine Corps has the smallest percentage of females serving, Marine Corps Times reported, and the branch has been slow to integrate men and women in boot camp as all other branches have already done.

The new report says Marine recruits have brushed aside female training staff in favor of male staff, who are seen as more authoritative, according to Marine Corps Times. And in one anecdote, drill instructors asked advice from a male peer while a female chief drill instructor stood ignored nearby.

It’s not clear whether the Corps will take the report’s advice. But the chief of staff for Marine Corps Training and Education Command, Col. Howard Hall, told Marine Corps Times it’s not as simple as tweaking training-level policies.

“It’s not something we would change overnight,” Hall said. “We’ve got a history of ‘sir, ma’am, sir, ma’am.’
« Last Edit: December 23, 2022, 03:00:25 am by 90sRetroFan »

90sRetroFan

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Re: True Left breakthrough: degendering
« Reply #26 on: December 28, 2022, 09:12:27 pm »
https://www.yahoo.com/news/lufthansa-no-longer-address-passengers-220126965.html

The good:

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Lufthansa Will No Longer Address Passengers As "Ladies And Gentlemen"
...
According to Travel + Leisure, “the German airline plans to do away with its traditional onboard greeting: ‘ladies and gentlemen, welcome on board.’ Instead, it will use gender-neutral alternatives, like ‘dear guests’ and a simple ‘welcome on board.’

The bad:

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That said, the use of “sir” and “ma’am” wouldn’t be banned on board.

The Turanian linguistic heritage:

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The publication wrote, “the language genders many words. Unlike English, which uses gender-neutral nouns, German has specific words for male doctor and female doctor and male editor and female editor.”

Similar sentiment has been expressed by Spanish, French and Italian groups, as all three languages utilize gendered words.

SirGalahad

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Re: Random Thoughts....
« Reply #27 on: January 11, 2023, 11:09:21 pm »
I feel like semantics are a massive reason why the debate on "sexuality" is often so unproductive. We call people's orientations "sexualities", as if sex is the core of a relationship and actual romantic love is merely an extension of that, when it should so obviously be the other way around. Romantic love should be the core, but of course, both traditional and progressive societies are too obsessed with sex to see the bigger picture. When you try to explain to a right winger who happens to be against homo"""sexuality""" why the concept shouldn't be looked down upon as any less meaningful than a hetero"""sexual""" relationship, the right winger in question will often immediately go to images of sodomy in their head, along with any other images typically associated with such a relationship that they personally find distasteful. And why WOULDN'T it conjure such images in their head, when even the words we use to describe ROMANTIC ATTRACTION involve the word "sex"? Why do we not call it something like homoromanticism or something similar? I know that the end goal is to drop words describing various attractions from common use all together since they weren't important until rightists and false leftists made it important, but it's so painfully obvious that it was a mistake to let dishonorable people coin these terms in the first place. By framing the debate as heterosexuality and homosexuality, they soiled the whole thing and made almost every single argument surrounding it less productive, since the very inception of the word "sexuality". In short, the conflation of sex with romance drives me mad
« Last Edit: January 11, 2023, 11:17:02 pm by SirGalahad »
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guest78

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Re: Re: Random Thoughts....
« Reply #28 on: January 12, 2023, 02:25:46 am »
"By framing the debate as heterosexuality and homosexuality, they soiled the whole thing and made almost every single argument surrounding it less productive, since the very inception of the word "sexuality". In short, the conflation of sex with romance drives me mad..."

But, "There are plenty of fish in the sea", "The world is your oyster", and sometimes you just need to "soil your oats".  ;D

Billy Kid

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Re: Re: Random Thoughts....
« Reply #29 on: January 12, 2023, 08:28:13 am »
Also doesn’t help that false leftists chose identity over individuality, so instead of having a united front against homophobia and transphobia, we just have a squabbling mess arguing over which box people are best crammed into. Exactly what rightists want.
« Last Edit: January 12, 2023, 08:31:11 am by Billy Kid »