Author Topic: Leftists against progressivism  (Read 11389 times)

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Re: Leftists against progressivism
« Reply #60 on: April 03, 2023, 12:20:46 am »
Rightists beome aware of True Leftism:

https://www.yahoo.com/news/left-now-demonic-aim-ordinary-120000170.html

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The Left now has a demonic new aim: to make ordinary people poorer

There is nothing demonic about it, quite the contrary:

en.wikipedia.org


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Among some individuals, poverty is considered a necessary or desirable condition, which must be embraced to reach certain spiritual, moral, or intellectual states. Poverty is often understood to be an essential element of renunciation in religions such as Buddhism, Hinduism (only for monks, not for lay persons) and Jainism, whilst in Christianity, in particular Roman Catholicism, it is one of the evangelical counsels. The main aim of giving up things of the materialistic world is to withdraw oneself from sensual pleasures (as they are considered illusionary and only temporary in some religions—such as the concept of dunya in Islam).

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We are living through the most startling political realignment in more than 100 years. Never since the advent of modern socialism in the early 20th century has the Left openly advocated making ordinary people poorer, thereby leaving those on the Right to defend the spread of mass prosperity.

Yes:

https://trueleft.createaforum.com/true-left-vs-right/western-civilization-is-ugly-48/msg4254/#msg4254

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en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Christian_views_on_poverty_and_wealth

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    Perrotta points out that material wealth is highly valued in the Old Testament; the Hebrews seek it and God promises to bless them with it if they will follow his commandments.[12] Joseph Francis Kelly writes that biblical writers leave no doubt that God enabled men such as Abraham, Isaac, Jacob and Solomon to achieve wealth and that this wealth was a sign of divine favor.
    ...
    Jesus explicitly condemns excessive love of wealth as an intrinsic evil in various passages in the Gospels, especially in Luke (Luke 16:10–15 being an especially clear example). He also consistently warns of the danger of riches as a hindrance to favor with God

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Where organised protest movements in the past have been inspired by the idea that the masses were too poor, now they promote the idea that most ordinary people are too rich.

False Leftism is fading and True Leftism is dawning.

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everyone accepted the underlying assumption that it was desirable for as many people as possible to become progressively better off.

Not us! We were never progressives!

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Until very recently, there was no respectable voice calling for an end to the spread of prosperity to the developing world, as well as in the advanced nations.

Regressivism has very recently entered the discourse!

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Now it is not just the juvenile Left making this extraordinary demand. Politicians of the centre-Right who had adopted pretty much wholesale the doctrine of social justice – which is to say, everybody having an equal chance for economic self-determination and a materially comfortable life – find themselves having to justify penalising ordinary people for heating their homes or for travelling beyond their own neighbourhoods.

Prior to the colonial era, most people did not travel beyond their neighbourhoods:

https://trueleft.createaforum.com/true-left-vs-false-left/true-left-breakthrough-ahimsa/msg15224/#msg15224

https://trueleft.createaforum.com/issues/anti-gentrification/msg15225/#msg15225

and certainly did not use central heating:

https://trueleft.createaforum.com/issues/decolonized-housing-(america-edition)/msg10221/#msg10221

The pre-colonial lifestyle is what we want to get the world back to.

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Of course, the Industrial Revolution will not go down without a fight.

See you on the battlefield.

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the eco-Left’s next project. That is to abolish animal farming, which has been a civilising feature of human society for much longer. The devastation that such a ban would create on rural life would rank with the Enclosures Act as a social and economic cataclysm.

Yes, after de-Westernization comes de-Turanization:

https://trueleft.createaforum.com/true-left-vs-right/farming-vs-ranching/

Continuing:

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In the 18th century many of those earlier displaced farming people – the ones who did not simply perish – could be absorbed into the emerging new industries, thereby creating the proletariat on which Marx founded his revolutionary ideology. What would happen to the new legions of former dairy, sheep and pig farmers? Would they all be expected to find new jobs in the green energy business?

They should be killed the same way they have endorsed their countless victims being killed.

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Modern social democratic principles would have to be applied, wouldn’t they?

Absolutely not! We are regressives, remember? Autocracy all the way!

I'm already debate with many of my fellows on this case and they cannot give a logical answer, so I won, but they still don't want to agree with me instead consider me backward and "not objective". Any other way?

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Re: Leftists against progressivism
« Reply #61 on: April 03, 2023, 12:23:44 am »
@90sRetroFan Notice how they called us the JUVENILE left. What a supreme compliment. And that unintentional compliment is more genuinely meaningful than anything they’ve said up to this point. They can keep calling us juvenile, immature, hypersensitive, or regressive all they want. In my opinion, they should also add “simpleton” to their vernacular. If ONLY the world were populated with more simpletons to honor simplicity, instead of people who worship increasing complexity
« Last Edit: April 03, 2023, 12:30:04 am by SirGalahad »

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Re: Leftists against progressivism
« Reply #62 on: April 03, 2023, 02:30:33 am »
The truly meaningful question is not what civilization can make itself powerful enough to give people, but what people deserve to be given in the first place (even assuming unlimited power to give it to them). The truly superior civilization is not the one which gives people the most, but the one which gives people closest to what they deserve.

If everyone were to be given everything they desire (which is what progressives aim for), that would mean that those who desire more would be given more while those who desire less would be given less. But those who desire more are inferior to those who desire less. Thus if everyone were given everything they desire, the inferior would be given more than the superior. This is why the progressive aim is morally despicable.

The superior deserve more than the inferior. But the superior are precisely those who desire less. Therefore if the most superior deserve what they desire (which should be very little), everyone else deserves even less than that!

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Re: Leftists against progressivism
« Reply #63 on: April 03, 2023, 10:17:20 pm »
One time I thought about how someone can make more money by living at a lower cost, so I found this movement called "Becoming Rich by Being Poor on Purpose". TBH, I wanted to do something like that. Now that I think about it, it's a little greedy when being poor is a means goal and not an end goal like you'd prefer.

I spoke about doing it with one of my relatives. They were upset at me saying I was "blessed" because I live in a "nice" home. That means they want me to live a more materialistic life, whereas you'd be upset at me because you'd want me to live a less materialistic life. Thinking about that too, when only certain people are blessed, then no one is blessed.

Also thinking about what you'd probably say, isn't it the duty of a healthy economy according to Aryanism where no one is poor?:

web.archive.org


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A healthy national economy from the National Socialist perspective is simply an economy where nobody is hungry or homeless or otherwise in fear over their imminent future, and where nobody is in debt to anybody else.

Of course the simpler the better, but don't we all need some sort of housing, even low income housing?

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Re: Leftists against progressivism
« Reply #64 on: April 03, 2023, 11:30:28 pm »
"isn't it the duty of a healthy economy according to Aryanism where no one is poor?"

Yes, but "poor" by modern standards is already rich by historically typical standards. For example, it is historically typical for the poor to tend to be underweight, yet the modern so-called "poor" in First World countries tend to be overweight. This is the absurd baseline of excessive affluence we are dealing with.

(And don't get me started about beggars I encounter on the street holding the latest smartphones while I am still using my flip phone from the 2000s..... I have also seen them throw used stuff away like it's nothing instead of reusing, whereas I am to this day still using the same toothbrush I got for my 7th birthday..... And they have the nerve to ask me for money!)

"don't we all need some sort of housing, even low income housing?"

Yes. This is why I am annoyed by:

https://trueleft.createaforum.com/news/re-duginism-1134/msg16994/#msg16994

https://trueleft.createaforum.com/true-left-vs-false-left/jews-have-nothing-in-common-with-us!/msg11512/#msg11512

and why I am a Hitler fan:

https://trueleft.createaforum.com/colonial-era/hitler-the-face-of-anti-tribalism/msg16998/#msg16998

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Re: Leftists against progressivism
« Reply #65 on: April 04, 2023, 02:47:06 am »
"Yes, but "poor" by modern standards is already rich by historically typical standards. For example, it is historically typical for the poor to tend to be underweight, yet the modern so-called "poor" in First World countries tend to be overweight. This is the absurd baseline of excessive affluence we are dealing with."
Unfortunately, the extent of psychological colonization is so great that now in third-world countries, even non-poor underweight people are viewed as "malnourished", "impoverished", etc. The dominant view nowadays is that being a "well-fed" chubby kid is a symbol of "prosperity", "health" (lol).

"(And don't get me started about beggars I encounter on the street holding the latest smartphones while I am still using my flip phone from the 2000s..... I have also seen them throw used stuff away like it's nothing instead of reusing, whereas I am to this day still using the same toothbrush I got for my 7th birthday..... And they have the nerve to ask me for money!)"
Not going to make any generalizations, but I have also noticed that this is largely a "White" homeless thing. Yet the False Left and Right will insist that "White" beggars don't have privilege...

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Re: Leftists against progressivism
« Reply #66 on: April 04, 2023, 03:57:19 am »
"Unfortunately, the extent of psychological colonization is so great that now in third-world countries, even non-poor underweight people are viewed as "malnourished", "impoverished", etc. The dominant view nowadays is that being a "well-fed" chubby kid is a symbol of "prosperity", "health" (lol)."

I don't think this is due to psychological colonization. What you describe was the mainstream view long before the colonial era.

This history of obesity (the stone age through the renaissance) described by a physician.
Sermo · sermo.com


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Anthropologic diggings that cross from northern Africa through Europe and to Eastern Russia have uncovered some figures that depict what was the ideal body of the time, obese by our standards.

The early Egyptians left carvings on walls that depicted the “ideal” body shape.  Excess weight was a symbol of prosperity for both men and women.  The attitude that obesity meant success dates to the earliest of Egyptian writings and / or artefacts.

Also in the BC era, the Book of Isaiah cites fatness as a way to freedom.  “The LORD of hosts will arouse a scourge against him . . . His staff will be over the sea and He will lift it up . . . so it will be in that day, that his burden will be removed from your shoulders and his yoke from your neck, and the yoke will be broken because of fatness. “

Throughout the world, obesity was considered a sign of success, power, and wealth.  In China, plump beauty was the status of both the Tang and the Song dynasty.  China had been divided under prior dynasties and was again reunified.   During the era of the Tang and Song Dynasties, “China became the richest, powerful and most advanced country in the world.” Paintings of Emperors and other powerful figures emphasize their “robust” size.

The Renaissance Era occurred almost simultaneously in Europe and the UK.  They too saw extra weight as a symbol of success, wealth, power (success and wealth were associated with not having to work the fields or early mills), and health.   Why better health?  The belief was that extra weight might help withstand infectious diseases.  During this era, Rubens (1577–1640) regularly portrayed full-bodied women in his pictures, which portrayed men and women considered beautiful then, but obese by today’s standards.

I will end this first post on the history of obesity with a quote from a poem of William Shakespeare, who often commented on fatness, voluptuous women, and men of large size.

“My beauty as the spring doth yearly grow; My flesh is soft and plump, my marrow burning.”

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Re: Leftists against progressivism
« Reply #67 on: April 04, 2023, 07:15:06 am »
You make a good point. Perhaps colonization has merely elevated this already existing view by increasing the overall standard of living.

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Re: Leftists against progressivism
« Reply #68 on: April 10, 2023, 05:19:20 pm »
"Notice how they called us the JUVENILE left. What a supreme compliment. And that unintentional compliment is more genuinely meaningful than anything they’ve said up to this point. They can keep calling us juvenile, immature, hypersensitive, or regressive all they want. In my opinion, they should also add “simpleton” to their vernacular. If ONLY the world were populated with more simpletons to honor simplicity, instead of people who worship increasing complexity"

Latest Duchesne:

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Blacks think with the mouth, as was the case among all primitive peoples. Like children, they suppose that the naming of something brings about the physical thing it denotes. And since liberalism makes whites childlike, they think blacks are profound.

As I keep saying:

https://trueleft.createaforum.com/true-left-vs-false-left/truth-knowledge/msg14781/#msg14781

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Western civilization considers itself superior to non-Western civilizations in the same sense that adults consider themselves superior to children. And just as children have been mostly conditioned to agree that adults really are superior by accepting the adult standards of superiority, non-Western civilizations have similarly been mostly conditioned to agree that Western civilization is superior by accepting Western standards of superiority. Only we can see that the truth is the complete opposite.

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Re: Leftists against progressivism
« Reply #69 on: April 10, 2023, 09:27:18 pm »
If "blacks" think with the mouth, then what do "whites" think with (take a good guess)? Better to "think with the mouth" than speak without thinking:
https://trueleft.createaforum.com/true-left-vs-right/trump-supporters-and-the-three-types-of-readers-by-adolf-hitler/msg16852/#msg16852

Also, he is wrong that the "primitive peoples" were like children. But perhaps he is right that "non-White" primitive peoples were less adulterated than their Giant counterparts.

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Re: Leftists against progressivism
« Reply #70 on: April 29, 2023, 10:40:31 pm »
Bill Maher (Jew) trashed for progressive stance on slavery. Maher says that slavery was just a "product of their time" (lol):


(Yes, I know Majority Report is run by Sam Seder (Jew) and that they are progressives, but this was a good video nevertheless which was why I decided to post it)

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Re: Leftists against progressivism
« Reply #71 on: April 29, 2023, 11:32:15 pm »
"Maher says that slavery was just a "product of their time""

This is actually true, but not in the way progressives mean. Progressives (including Maher) say this statement as a claim that modern people have as a whole morally progressed beyond slavery. The truth is that modernity has industrially progressed such that slavery is economically inefficient. Were slavery to become economically valuable again, modern people would surely have no problem going back to it. Indeed, the forms of slavery that remained economically valuable (e.g. non-humans) not only never stopped but only worsened with the transition to modernity:

https://trueleft.createaforum.com/true-left-vs-right/western-civilization-sustainable-evil/

Once we include non-humans, the total number of slaves being kept today exceeds by many orders of magnitude those in any pre-modern era. This is why the regressive view is the correct one.

Vigeland is also an airhead, trying desperately to find a way to explain why colonial-era slavery is worse than ancient slavery but settling on colonial-era slavery being "chattel slavery" instead of pointing out that colonial-era "whites" were not enslaving other "whites" while they were enslaving "non-whites", whereas ancient enslavers at least enslaved anyone. (But Vigeland is a progressive herself, so what can we expect?)

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Re: Leftists against progressivism
« Reply #72 on: April 29, 2023, 11:43:23 pm »
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The truth is that modernity has industrially progressed such that slavery is economically inefficient. Were slavery to become economically valuable again, modern people would surely have no problem going back to it. Indeed, the forms of slavery that remained economically valuable (e.g. non-humans) not only never stopped but only worsened with the transition to modernity:

This opinion on slavery is a communist thing. I'm sure Maher is implicitly a Marxist

Compare him to Karl Marx's thinking

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"Without slavery, North America, the most progressive of countries, would be transformed into a patriarchal country. Wipe out North America from the map of the world and you will have anarchy— the complete decay of modern commerce and civilization. Abolish slavery and you will have wiped America off the map of nations.10- Karl Heinrich Marx

What Marx was saying in effect was that Negro slaves were needed to produce raw cotton; cotton was the basic raw material of modern capitalist industry; therefore, Negro slavery was necessary to the survival of America and to the survival of modern civilization.

Source : Karl Marx Racist by Nathaniel Weyl, page 75

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Slavery, at its time, represented a great leap beyond barbarism. Slavery was a necessary stage in the development of the productive forces, culture and society. As explained by Hegel: "It is not from slavery, but through slavery that humans become free". (Hegel, Philosophy of History)

Source :

See this post for knowing more about authentic Communism : https://trueleft.createaforum.com/true-left-vs-false-left/communism/msg18692/#msg18692

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Re: Leftists against progressivism
« Reply #73 on: August 30, 2023, 01:17:48 am »
While regressive True Leftists have been exhaustively explaining why we should hate the Industrial Revolution, what have progressive False Leftists been doing? Answer: trying to prove the Industrial Revolution was started by "non-whites". Yes, really:

A process for converting scrap metal into high-quality iron, which was crucial to the Industrial Revolution, was devised by Black metallurgists who were enslaved and transported to Jamaica by the B...
New Scientist · newscientist.com







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Re: Leftists against progressivism
« Reply #74 on: October 12, 2023, 08:52:17 pm »
Consistency:





Note in the first tweet the "smug liberal" is the one depicted as pro-Zionist and pro-Manifest-Destiny. This implies that anti-Zionist and anti-Manifest-Destiny people no longer want to be categorized as liberals. This is a positive sign.